daveon: (Default)
[personal profile] daveon
My mother called me this morning.  Fairly remarkable actually, mum's in her 80s and is never quite sure which number to use.  Anyway, she had a letter from a debt collection agency about my 'debt' - this was news to me.  Apart from the mortgage I don't actually have any debt in the UK.  She passed me the details and I called them.

Apparently, back in 2009, Orange didn't close my phone account cleanly and continued to register it as open and billing and now the debt, 80 quid, has caught up with me.  This falls into the space of one of those things that is a nightmare.  Do I just pay it to make it go away, or do I dispute it and deal with the problems that not living in the UK generates - we've already had that as the debt agency can't call a US number, nor write to a US address.  In fact, the conversation was fairly comical:

"You did have an Orange account opened in 2005?"
"Yes, but I moved to the US in 2007."
"But this XXX is your address?"
"Until I moved to the US in 2007."
"Umm...  but you were using the phone?"
"No, I was living in America, where I live now."

Bit daft really, and it really does feel like a thing I'll end up paying because it will be just too damn painful to fight it anymore.  But I have disputed the charge.

Date: 2014-01-27 05:46 pm (UTC)
drplokta: (Default)
From: [personal profile] drplokta
Can't you just ignore it? What are the chances that Orange will take legal action against someone living in a different country over £80?

Date: 2014-01-27 06:15 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] daveon.livejournal.com
Depends if we decide to come back, credit dings are persistent buggers even if they haven't gone to County Court, there's always the option that I might want to remortgage.

Date: 2014-01-27 09:26 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] palatinate.livejournal.com
For that amount from that far away, I'd settle, although I'd have one go at arguing with Orange first.

Date: 2014-01-27 11:20 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] daveon.livejournal.com
That's pretty much my approach. Although the problem is now the matter has to be referred back to the company Orange sold the debt to. So I'm not sure how that works or even, after all this time, they can. I'm thinking that given the situation they might decide it's easier for them to write it off? Otherwise I'll settle. I doubt Orange will even see it.

Date: 2014-01-28 12:26 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] a-cubed.livejournal.com
Add on being a victim of impersonation fraud (so-called identity theft). I've had to deal with three fraudulent loans taken out using my details during the period from first starting to spend long portions of the year in Japan, the first two while still resident in the UK and the final one (so far) when I'd moved here. Ex-pat comeswith all sorts of issues about the old country that probably never used to be an issue because even twenty years ago people were so much harder to track down overseas.

Date: 2014-01-28 01:13 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] filkerdave.livejournal.com
I've also noticed that while US customer service isn't very good, the UK seems to have elevated customer disservice to an art form.

Date: 2014-01-28 03:50 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] daveon.livejournal.com
The UK most certainly has its moments :)

I'd say both countries have weird strengths and weaknesses. In the UK they're more likely to be out and out rude to you, whereas in the US they'll pretend to be nice while treating you badly.

There are times when I miss people actually being rude :)

Date: 2014-01-28 03:11 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] sarahx.livejournal.com
This (if you remember) is something I have far too much experience in, albeit vicariously, thanks to the mess T was dumped in by his sociopathic (being polite here) ex.

First, if you have had no contact from Orange about the debt for a period of at least six years, then it is statute-barred and therefore unenforceable. So you need documentary proof from Orange that they had contacted you about it within the relevant timescale. If the supposed debt dates back to 2007, this may well be the case. This is the most likely way to get rid of it without paying, unless Orange are prepared to fess up that they screwed up closing your account. Also, if they can't produce the original credit agreement, as signed by you, the debt is similarly unenforceable.

Second, these debt-buying collection agencies are an absolute bunch of crooks and will say anything - legal or otherwise - to screw the cash out of you. They pay pennies for debts that have gone bad, and their entire business model is to harass people into paying up, regardless of whether the money is owed, or the debt enforceable. They will send letters to anyone with the same name - or even a different one that's close - or hassle family, new people at the old address, anyone they can think of, and demand that they pay up. They will be rubbing their hands with glee that you bothered to call them, unfortunately.

Ultimately, the final sanction comes from the Financial Ombudsman Service, to which you have right of appeal once you have given the company eight weeks (IIRC) to fix it and you have come to an impasse. Several of the ones T was landed with went away, thanks to the FOS deeming the debts unenforceable. But it does take time. And (also unfortunately) not all of the debt-bastards have signed up with the FOS.

However. As I said on FB, the amount of hassle and cost (money and time) and palaver it will take to get it to go away is probably not worth it, at least not for £80. Credit black marks fall off your credit history after six years, but if you want to remortgage in the meantime, that will be a problem. It is very wrong that the only sane way to make the hassle go away is usually to pay these parasites.

Date: 2014-01-28 09:18 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] t--m--i.livejournal.com
Got in touch with the Graunie's consumer affairs man years back when I was having issues with a car insurance thing. He was surprisingly helpful; possibly they don't get as many coherent, sensible complaints as they would like...;)

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