London Stuff

[daveon]

Interesting article here.  Basically thoughts on doing London on the cheap.  I'd only disagree with the idea of the 7 day travel card.  Get an Oyster card with the same amount of credit, it's easier to use, you won't accidentally demagnetize the strip, it won't crumple up in your pocket and get stuck in the machines by day 3, and you can use it without taking it out of your pocket/wallet/bag pocket.

Other things I recommend are the hop-on/hop-off bus tours.  Usually good fun, you get to see a lot and then you can decide to get off where you like.

If it is a first trip to London my personal must sees would be Big Ben, Parliament, Westminster Abbey.  Trafalgar Square, and walk/drive down the Mall to Buckingham Palace.  Horseguards parade.  Then over the city for St Pauls, the Tower and Tower Bridge.

General stuff: Science Museum, Natural History Museum, British Museum (where you can see the world's treasures thoughtfully taken and 'looked' after by a range of batshit crazy Victorians), National Gallery, Tate Modern.

Of interest to SF fans: HMS Belfast (next door to Tower Bridge) WW2 ship decked out as a museum, excellent one too.  Cutty Sark - now pretty much rebuilt and near Greenwich.  Imperial War Museum. Churchill's War Room (part of the IWM but in a different place), RAF Museum at Hendon,

For eating on the cheap - Weatherspoon's Pubs are cheap and cheerful and serve decent portions for little money and usually have beer and wine specials.

On the whole, Americans who live in large cities will be pleasantly surprised by the price of a pint of beer in the UK, even London.  Pints are Imperial 20oz pints and based on my last trip, you'd expect to pay $6/$6.50 a pint...  which is better than what I find myself paying in Seattle for a non-Happy Hour 16oz pint in Seattle.   In SF I'm seeing $8/$9+ for a Guiness and similar.  In Vegas at the weekend, a 12oz bottle of beer was $7...  And there's no expected tip on the price, so it's cheaper than you think.  Likewise, wine is MUCH cheaper in bars and restaurants than any city I've spent time in in the US.  You should have no trouble finding a decent bottle of wine for $25 or less, and in many places, two 250ml glasses will get the rest of the bottle for free.

One cautionary note.  Spirits.  They have to be served in exact measures of 25ml, and believe me, 25ml of spirits in the bottom of a glass is a very very sorry looking pour indeed :(

Generally speaking, as has been the case for decades, the best deal for a sit down meal with alcoholic beverages will always be a curry where for $40 a head, you'll have multiple courses with side dishes and drinks... probably lots of drinks... and if you pick the right restaurant a complementary after dinner drink.

I'll think more about tips for travel and what I'd do if I was seeing London for the first time.

Comments

[vicarage.livejournal.com]

Sound advice. I'd also suggest the best walk in London is along the Thames from Tower Bridge to Westminster Bridge, on the south side as there's less traffic and most of the famous buildings are on the north bank. I'd say a hop-on-off riverboat might be better than a bus, as you can get from Westminster to Greenwich on it.

I'd not bother with the Science Museum though, as its been outclassed by its rivals. The Natural History Museum and Maritime Museum are still world-class, and the British Museum is just the best of its type anywhere.

Note that St Pauls and Westminster Abbey charge a lot unless you go for a service or organ concert, the rest are mostly free, except The Tower of London which is expensive, but you could spend all day there. I'd not bother with HMS Belfast if you've seen US preserved ships.

London is chock full of industrial archeology, you can go inside Tower Bridge, the Kew Steam Engines are amazing when in stream. Combine the latter with Kew Gardens on a sunny day.

Lots of medical museums, the Hunterian Museum is full of bizarre medical things in jars, and the Old Operating Theatre is great.

Things to avoid: Madam Tuassauds, the Shard, London Transport Museum, as they are expensive for what you get.

[bibliogirl.livejournal.com]

I'll concur with Madam Tussauds being overpriced and, somewhat, also with the Shard -- though it's a view you won't get anywhere else, and if you like views, that may be enough. The LTMuseum is really good if you are a transport nerd, but less good otherwise.

Horniman Museum is fun if you happen to be in the area although perhaps not worth making a special trip for.

Carnaby St/Camden are fun if you are that way inclined. Some things there are horribly overpriced (the usual tourist tat) but in Camden in particular there is nice stuff to be had.

[daveon.livejournal.com]

With you on Tussauds, it was a steaming pile of shit when I was a kid so I can't imagine the last 30-35 years have improved matters. Ended up there once because the Planetarium was closed. Words fail to describe how miserable that day was...

Carnaby Street and areas around the West End are excellent if that's what you like. I might write a separate bit on that.

We're thinking a LOT about this because we're travelling with USian friends who've never been to the UK, let alone London and one of them has a serious back problem and, worse, a life threatening allergy to onions, all which is making planning the trip interesting.

[vicarage.livejournal.com]

If I had mobility problems, then deffo the riverboat over the bus

[bibliogirl.livejournal.com]

If the friend with the onion allergy is okay with Indian food, your key word there is "Jain". They do not use onions or garlic in their food, and we're planning to take my MIL (allergic to onion, although not as badly as your friend) and step-FIL (dislikes garlic) to a restaurant with that type of menu available when next they visit.

[daveon.livejournal.com]

She loves Indian food and was loving Mexican up until the moment she realized she needed Epineferin.

I have more of an issue with Jain options, she normally seeks them out here but her partner is a rabid carnivore so I'm sure you can see the problem.

[bibliogirl.livejournal.com]

Mmm, yes.

In that case I might suggest going for (decent) steak places, maybe? They won't be up to the standard of US steak places (by and large -- I like Gaucho just fine, but Ruth's Chris kicks its arse), but they might be better at keeping things apart.

[daveon.livejournal.com]

I has the problem of being a gourmand which makes life interesting, she'd kill me for Ruth's Chris, she even hates the Seattle one. But there's plenty of bistro options around London.

I'll just have to sneak off for me curry fix or do it all during the con,

[kate-schaefer.livejournal.com]

This will be our second trip to London. The first trip, the things we liked the best were the British Museum, Sir John Soane's Museum (it's kind of an acquired taste, but most science fiction fans are the sort of people with that sort of taste), the V & A, the Natural History Museum, hanging out with sf fans -- wait, were there any things we didn't like? We got lost once and ate inferior Chinese food once, but other than those, we had a fabulous time and want to do it again. Oh, and we experienced a bomb scare in the tube once; that wasn't fun at all, but it was dealt with quickly, and we had an alternate way to get where we were going.

[(Anonymous)]

I'd add to the walk down to Buck House a meander through St James' Park. A walk round Fortnum and Mason and up and down Burlington Arcade is also nice.

[jack-ryder.livejournal.com]

A discovery we made (for those interested) is the Cartoon Museum (http://www.cartoonmuseum.org/) which is around the block from the British Museum in a side street, so it's a little hard to find.

Highly recommend the Churchill War Rooms - allocate more time then you expect to go through it, because as well as the war rooms (which are fascinating in themselves) there's an entire museum devoted to Churchill in there. Took us by surprise as to its size and coverage.

The Holocaust exhibit in the Imperial War Museum is highly recommended but deeply upsetting. They do (thoughtfully) provide exits at certain points along the way. Didn't dare go into the Crimes Against Humanity exhibit after that.

I didn't find Forbidden Planet worth the visit (when we were there in 2012.) It's like it's collapsed in on itself. Off Charing Cross Road is Cecil Court - which seems entirely devoted to second hand book stores. Foyles is highly recommended as well (for those still with space in their luggage after Worldcon.)

Hoping to make it to the Natural History Museum, the Maritime Museum and back to the V&A this trip - as well as Sir John Soane's Museum - which is not far from where we're staying!

[bibliogirl.livejournal.com]

Forbidden Planet will surely not be worth the visit when compared with the LonCon dealers' room, unless you've got people in tow who are _really_ media-oriented...

[kate-schaefer.livejournal.com]

Oh, the Cartoon Museum! Tiny, well worth the time and trouble to find it. We saw the Ronald Searle exhibit in 2010, which included a lot of drawings from his time as a prisoner of war, very deeply moving drawings of other prisoners staring to death. He hid the drawings under the mattress of someone with TB (I think; maybe dysentery), since the guards didn't care to examine that mattress too closely.

[surliminal.livejournal.com]

Seconded the Churchill War Rooms which. Only discovered when speaking at a cybersecurity conf!

[jack-ryder.livejournal.com]

Oh yeah - if you have time remember to not take the Underground exclusively. There's lots of buses and they give you a better idea of the layout of London - and provide a much better view.

[daveon.livejournal.com]

The buses are great, but can be a royal pain to figure out even for a local.

I'm going to make another post on cellphones and SIM cards for Americans/Non-Europeans in London later.

[bohemiancoast.livejournal.com]

Honestly, they're vastly easier now -- between TFL's official route planner and the far superior Citymapper, it's pretty straightforward to find your bus. And they are cheaper, and often quicker for journeys that aren't directly along tube lines.

[daveon.livejournal.com]

I'm working on another post but I can't stress how terrifying US carrier data roaming charges are and how much of a massive pain a lot of London's WiFi is for visitors. So the apps are going to be a bit of a challenge for a lot of visitors.

Plus. Unlike the UK, almost every GSM phone is carrier locked unless you get your carrier to unlock it and that's not even an option for Verizon and Sprint users.

So I'm trying to present options based on limited or zero connectivity.

[bohemiancoast.livejournal.com]

That is true. Given how expensive data roaming is and what you've said about unlocking, people planning an extended trip to London might find it worth their while to buy themselves a PAYG MiFi -- about £50 plus a couple of quid a day for data.

[replyhazy.livejournal.com]

All good stuff, thanks much for posting.

[surliminal.livejournal.com]

Um sorry but this is not my vn - as a frequent viitor but not resident - of tourist London!! Dare I say it is rather male...

My two main runs when I,m in town are Waterloo to S Bank and then on to and/or Tate Modern (mostly free) and or Borough Market ( best food marker ever, loads of free samples). A drink outside at the Anchor on Bankside with view of the Thames is geat pitstop in nice weather. Maybe get a boat to Greenwich where theres another great market. Meanwhile at the S Bank you,ve got much going on for free, oudoor food stalls, skateboarding et al and of course the entire National Heatre to pick from as well as the Festival Hall and Imax. V often in summer festivals w lotsa free stuff.

The alternative is : start in Holborn or S Pauls, walk west through the inns of Court - free and beautiul. Then on to Covent Gdn flea market for cheap presents, the expensive artisan market for things for yourself :-) watch free street entertainers. shimmy through to down Charing Cross Rd doing the bk shops - veer off to Forbidden Planet if you want or Tottenham Ct Rd for tech porn - end up in theatrelAnd and do a show from the half price ticket booth.

Newer drags : go to Hoxton and look at the street grafitti, end up with a drink at the glorious Hoxton Hotel. If possible, stay there a night :-)

Food - yeh Brixton Lane for a curry but also tapas at Meson Felipe back of Waterloo, cocktails near there at Cubana, cheap south Indian near KX ( tho have these been bulldozed yet?), Viernamese at Old St, or cuisine hop on the cheap in lovely Fitzrovia, maybe combine w trip to British Museum an Gosh! Comics.

And if its nice remember London has glorious parks for free entry complete with every Brit trope you,d like - rowboats, swans, dek chairs etc. Kew Gdns. Hampstead Heath. If you,re in London in the summer go outside instead of paying a fortune for tourist traps!

[jack-ryder.livejournal.com]

We'll be staying near Holborn so I'll have to remember your tip about the Inns of Court.

[daveon.livejournal.com]

The other great walk from Holborn is towards the City via Farrigdon and the St John's arch and Clerkenwell, taking in the Smithfields Market. Great stuff there and fascinating.

[daveon.livejournal.com]

I did stress "first trip" part of my advice :)

It's amazing how 'traditional' first timers are about the sites.

I thought about tech, books and the like, but honestly TCR is a bit shite and now Murder One is going, is CxR going to be an improvement on the Dealers Room at Loncon? Personally I'd rather pull my toenails out than suggest Regent, Bond or Oxford St to anybody on the planet.

I'm finding it interesting that Harrods and The London Eye haven't come up because USian friends really REALLY want to go to Harrods.

[a-cubed.livejournal.com]

I'd recommend TheLondon Eye. If you're there long enough, the day-time and night-time flights are different enough to be separarely worthwhile.

[surliminal.livejournal.com]

I think a lot of women would rather do quirky shopping and theatre and bars than Tower of London - but there's room for both. I'd agree w A on London Eye - the touristy thjng I do do most places is go up something tall to get a view. Harrods - talk them out of it!

[daveon.livejournal.com]

I think you're underestimating the allure of a 1,000 year old castle... :)

Seriously M won't stop telling people about the tour

[daveon.livejournal.com]

Theatre is a good point though and worthy of a separate post. There's a lot of shows in London you can't get to see in most of the US. The Book of Mormon tickets were over $200 when it toured Seattle...

[gummitch.livejournal.com]

The number 11 bus route from Victoria station to Liverpool Street (or vice versa) goes past most of the first trip must-sees you mention. Details here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/London_Buses_route_11#Current_route

For lovers of the written word, the British Library Museum near St Pancras, is just terrific.

[daveon.livejournal.com]

For real first timers I'd still recommend an actual tour though. I've taken a couple of friends on them on their first time and it's always worked out well. Depending on the traffic and the time of day seeing anything from an actual commuter bus can be tricky.

[bibliogirl.livejournal.com]

Oh yes, the BL! Definitely.

[drpete.livejournal.com]

Some others:

For lovers of medical stuff, the Hunterian Museum at the Royal College of Surgeons (Lincoln's Inn Fields, just off Kingsway, Holborn) is free and worth a visit - if you're not squeamish. It has John Hunter's collection of anatomical and pathological specimens, plus a history of surgery exhibition. They're doing an exhibition on the great war andthe effect it had on surgery currently as well. Open Tues - Sat, 10-5 (free)

http://www.rcseng.ac.uk/museums/hunterian/information

Tate Britain has also just re-opened after a complete refurbishment and is fabulous. (free, specific exhibitions cost - see website)

http://www.tate.org.uk/visit/tate-britain

For those interested in aircraft, the RAF museum at Hendon is excellent. (free)

http://www.rafmuseum.org.uk/

[daveon.livejournal.com]

Definitely heading to the RAF Museum, my friend Bill is an aviation nut and very keen to see it. He's Japanese American an likes to remind people he had an Uncle at Pearl Harbour... yes... think about it :)

Both he and Karen are medical types, she's a former anesthesiologist and he's a cardiac PA so they might be interested. Their friend might also be coming who's an Internal Medicine physician at a local hospital.